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Old 03-29-2013, 05:07 PM View Post #11 (Link)
Maroon-Back 313 (Offline)
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Oh goodness I came across that "definately" thread and died. Laughing so hard. But I felt horrid for that poor new guy :c
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Old 03-29-2013, 08:19 PM View Post #12 (Link)
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Originally Posted by Derezzination View Post
If they have no motivation then there is no point making them stay, they are wasting their lives.
I disagree. They are spending thier lives as they wish. If they wish to do nothing with them, they are not wasting them, they are spending their time very badly.

Originally Posted by Wig View Post
How did you know I was talking about you, man?
There are two words people use when describing me, one of them being 'terrifying' and the other 'handsome', usually in the term, 'terrifyingly handsome'.
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Old 03-29-2013, 09:17 PM View Post #13 (Link)
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The problem I keep seeing is we get a lot of young members, around 12, 13, and because of their age they often only want to flirt with writing. They don't actually want to put in the slog and improve. It's also that their age limits them because writing is an extension of their reading level - and at 12 most people are reading shit. You can't automatically throw 'advanced' writers at them because their brain, IMO, just haven't moulded into a capacity of self-awareness, of reflection. It's those writers that flock our forums and then leave.

EDIT: Whilst we are on the topic of this, I feel like we need to foster an environment of more writers, otherwise it will just be us 'oldies'. We need 'fresh meat' who are good enough to want to write and want to improve, who don't need to be told how to write a sentence, or what an 'image' is. I mean, if we could target a demographic I think we should even move away from the idea of 'young' writers, and go towards 'young adults' (from like 15/16 upwards), and definitely aim to draw in university students - who by publishing industry are still considered young.
  
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Old 03-30-2013, 01:24 AM View Post #14 (Link)
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Originally Posted by Spacepirate View Post
The problem I keep seeing is we get a lot of young members, around 12, 13, and because of their age they often only want to flirt with writing. They don't actually want to put in the slog and improve. It's also that their age limits them because writing is an extension of their reading level - and at 12 most people are reading shit. You can't automatically throw 'advanced' writers at them because their brain, IMO, just haven't moulded into a capacity of self-awareness, of reflection. It's those writers that flock our forums and then leave.
I should probably argue with you, me being an example of why that's not an entirely true statement. I am 12 and stuck with the craft and I'd like to think I'm not horrible. But seeing as how it was generalized comment and for the most part it's true, I'm going to have to agree with you u_u. I wonder what happens to us younger writers if this site is suddenly moved toward an older crowd though? I would hate to be kicked out or something because the rest of the writers my age aren't putting in the effort.
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Old 03-30-2013, 04:44 AM View Post #15 (Link)
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Originally Posted by Spacepirate View Post
EDIT: Whilst we are on the topic of this, I feel like we need to foster an environment of more writers, otherwise it will just be us 'oldies'. We need 'fresh meat' who are good enough to want to write and want to improve, who don't need to be told how to write a sentence, or what an 'image' is. I mean, if we could target a demographic I think we should even move away from the idea of 'young' writers, and go towards 'young adults' (from like 15/16 upwards), and definitely aim to draw in university students - who by publishing industry are still considered young.
I understand your point, but I think we should be willing to dig through all the shitty ones to find real diamonds underneath. I mean, yeah, maybe nine out of ten pre-teen noobs here are complete babies who are just posting for the hell of getting a pat on the back. But there's always a chance that one of them might be worth working on. I mean, someone who might actually learn to take the craft seriously. I mean, I joined TW when I was 12/13. I was posting shit poetry, and got slammed down repeatedly for it.

I think the system is fine the way it is. If they wanna stay, they should stay. If they wanna leave, let them leave. If they come back, welcome them back. There will always be a new batch of writers next time anyway. We may get fewer new meat nowadays, but the ones we do get (and the ones who actually stay) are those that we can be proud of, I think.

han123 and Sbenzing, I'm talking about you!
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Old 03-30-2013, 05:27 AM View Post #16 (Link)
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why do we want to bring in more people who are not up to the standards of the site? it's like adding water to your milk just so you have more milk. i've seen lots of newbies who have been slaughtered and stayed, because they wanted to. the aim is to foster an environment for writers, not a social community for any teen who fancies themselves to be a writer.

over the past few months i've seen a lot of newbies in the poetry forums and i'm proud of those members. the heater lady, acida, sbenzing, me, niente etc who have stayed and are the sort of members we need on the site. i do agree that the site should aim to take everybody in and improve them as writers, but we should be selective enough to accept only the people who are serious about it.

i'm pretty happy with the system the way it is. the site is welcoming enough, but still is a bit strict. it's like having an open bar with a bouncer at the door. let's just hope the bouncer scares away the unwanted elements, and doesn't have to do the dirty work.
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Old 03-30-2013, 06:09 AM View Post #17 (Link)
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I agree with Ares.

In my experience, the people who stay are usually the ones we want sticking around, and the ones who leave weren't offering much to the group anyway. As far as newbies go, at least.
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Old 03-30-2013, 09:30 AM View Post #18 (Link)
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Michelangelo said: "In fact, the only good statue is the statue, that rolled down from the mountain because while it was rolling, all redundant broke off."
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Old 03-30-2013, 10:48 AM View Post #19 (Link)
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I can see what Spacey means. The majority of writers here are really young and don't have much push in themselves to publish, because at that age, no-one is going to give you a second glance. There are a few people who want to get published and really I think that's enough. We have a Publishing Bootcamp and the people who are serious about it join it. Then there are the people who just want to improve their writing and I'm fine with that.

In the end, we are really rather perfect. We're not your run of the mill, 'This is so brillig!' site, but neither are we an elitist, 'If you're not planning on publishing anytime soon then get out.' site. We cater to the people who like one thing. Writing, and usually writing seriously.
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Old 03-30-2013, 12:11 PM View Post #20 (Link)
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My point isn't about completely ignoring promising young newbies. Nor is it about 'adding water to milk': yes, I do know what diluting means. Obviously if newbies stick it out then they are to keep - but that's a pretty self-selected process anyway. If people put in the hard work, are willing to critique/write/read/learn and improve then great. If not, they leave. No great loss. As our eternal god and saviour espouses, if a newb cannot, will not critique then:

Spoiler:

YWO is pretty great, I agree. And sure you've reeled off a number of great members; maybe I'm just a little impatient but most of those members are at least a few months old. Do we have any promising new new members? Perhaps i am just not paying enough attention. Perhaps it just takes time. (Not to mention those members are all poetry-based. The short stories, novel side of things aren't so productive I feel.)

And not to economise everything but in terms of influx/efflux, I feel as if we are still losing more 'decent' members than we are getting. A lot of the oldies (whom I was writing with when in my previous incarnation) are either just gone or contribute little to the actual writing side of things. I'm not the only one who sees this am I? I mean, this isn't a problem per se because obviously we can't force people to write, to stick around - but ideally we would have the same level of people coming in, to make up for the loss; something which I don't feel like we are achieving.

I guess at the end of the day I am more curious than anything else as to why this site is proportionately skewed towards the younger age group. (As I said, not necessarily a bad thing.) Why do we not get many older-teens or 20-somethings, and if occasionally we do get an intro thread, they don't seem to stick. It just seems that that is a group of people this site doesn't really tap into, or represents, which seems a shame to me - and I'd like to find out why. It could well be that 20somethings are too busy for the internet or to look for writing sources online or whatever. What I wouldn't want it to be was that they were put off by the site for it being 'young'.

Say we need 'good' members. Do we have to just wait around for them, sorting out the wheat from the field-full of chaff? Or is there another way we can do things? Can we be proactive about it? I don't know, I'm just thought-showering here.
  
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